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Author Topic: Klingon Medals and Decorations  (Read 5055 times)
Krag
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« on: 10 06, 2005, 10:17: AM »

If a Klingon wished to display their medals, which would be more important -- the D'Har Master medal or the Order of Kahless medal? And from what I have gathered, the Klingon Medal of Honor (as worn by Gen. Chang) would rank below these two honors.

In a DS9 episode, Kor is held in awe and reverence by his fellow Klingons for being a D'Har Master. It seems this would be the highest honorific a Klingon could hold...?
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« Reply #1 on: 10 06, 2005, 01:52: PM »

Greetings Krag,

Unfortunately You Are Asking a Question That May well lie within the Pervue of Specific Club Guidelines rather than by any Particular Canon Established Precedent...

Now That Having Been Said, Presumeably their are Very Few DaHar Masters per se'... Yet, Each of the Other Awards Are Also Supposed to be Extremely Elite... In the Case of the M.O.H. I am Not Sure that Changs Medal "Was" a M.O.H. though I Know that Some Clubs Treat it as Such... (If there is a Canon Confirmation that-that is what he wore I Am Simply Ignorant of it)... As Far as The Order of the batlh Goes... Well Once again we Really only have The One Episode of DS-9 to go by (As Far as I Know)...

So it Kind of Becomes a Matter of Guesswork I Should think, And Again the Preference of a Given Club... Many Very Neat Looking Medals Exist out there that Have No Canon Significance at all, and Others Were Created by a Given Group and Copied by others without having a Known Meaning... So it is Hard to Answer Such a Question in a Manor which would be Recognized by All of Klindom...

For Myself, I am a Very "Rule" Oriented Individual, so to me Wearing a Medal of any Sort which has Not been Specifically Awarded is Kind of "Cheesy"... And I Do not Take it Very Seriously When I see People Claiming Grandiose Honors like Being a DaHar Master or The Receipient of the M.O.H. or Claiming to be an Inductee into the Order of the Batlh... On the Other Hand, When Someone has Earned an Established Award within their Club for Say Exemplory Service to the Organization, For Charity Work or For Performing some Great and Selfless Act, Then I Have a Great Deal of Respect for that Award regardless of rather it is One Recognized Either By My Own Club or by Canon Sources...

If this Question is Academic on the Other Hand, and it is Research for a Piece of Fiction For Instance... Then I Would Suggest that One Keep in Mind that Certain Guidelines do Exist for the Order of Loyalty that a Klingon Holds. My own Understanding (Which is Subjective and Perhaps even Flawed), Would Go Like this Listed From The Greatest (At the Top of the List), to the Most Personal (At the Bottom):

-The Empire... (Read Larger Fandom)...
-Organizational Unit... (Read Local Club)...
-Unit... (Read Club Chapter, Ship Etc.)...
-Family... (Read Line or House Ties)...
-The Individual... (That would be Pretty Darn Obvious, and refer to Ones Own Honor)...

So Although Without Ones Own Highly Esteemed Sense of Personal Honor it is Impossible to Be Honorable, (Or Loyal) to those Steps Above, it is Still the Lowest Priority in terms of the Ultimate Loyalty and Honor which is the Good of the Empire...

So Why Did I Go into all of this? Well, If One were to Recieve a Given Award (Regardless of What it was Called) by ones Ship, then it would be Placed Lower than if it was Granted by the Club itself, But Would Be Placed Higher than One Given by Ones Family, or say a Family Crest...

So We Have to Ask Who Awards a M.O.H. ? Or The Order of the Batlh? And Who has the Authority to Award Such Status as Being a DaHar Master? The Simple Answer is...<Shrugs Shoulders>... I Don't Really Know... But The Priority Could be Broken down As Follows

-Order of the Batlh... This is A Big Deal, it is not Just an Award, but a Recognition that One has Become a Member of the Empires Trully Elite, Very Few Would Receive this Honor, But Once Awarded it is Not Seen as A Personal Thing... It is Membership, It is Fraternity, It is Status Based Less on the Individual and More on Being a Part of That Elite Group...
-M.O.H. While Significant, this is something of a Personal Award, it is Granted to the Individual for that Individuals Greater Contribution to the Whole, but it is Still That Particular Warriors Award...
-DaHar... This would be Huge, but Very Personal as it Reflects Ones Understanding of what it means to be Klingon... So it is Not Perhaps an Imperial Issue so much as the Driving Force behind that Persons Drive to be the Best Klingon Possible, or perhaps more appropriately the Most Klingon Possible... So Like The Rating of the Individual at the Bottom of the List Above in terms of Priority, it is Likely Both the Least Tangible and thus the "Lowest" Priority, yet in some ways most Important because without the Personal Sense of Intergrity and Honor None of the Rest is Possible...

I Would Like to Know More about where this Question is Coming From... Would you be Willing to Elaborate? And again I Extend my Welcome to You Klag...
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« Reply #2 on: 10 06, 2005, 02:24: PM »

Medals & titles that are named in few (or even one) episode are somewhat of a problem in fandom. THis is because we really have no information on them. To this day all we really know about D'Har is that there are those who have mastered it and Kor is one of them. As to what D'Har actually is or how one masters it, there is nothing canon that I know of to enlighten us. That being said, a great many clubs have created a high honor and called it D'Har Master, but it bears no relation to all the other D'Har Master titles awarded by different clubs.

I agree that for the most part this is going to be left to a club to decide when, where and how they are worn on that clubs uniform. As for the MoH, I have never known that as a specific name for what Chang wore. The first club I was in called that one (which in the old days we used to call a butter cookie) called a diplomatic medal and gave it to all Ambasadors.

My personal opinion is that such canon names should be off limits for fandom. We should instead concentrate on medals and awards that actually mean something to the organization and its membership.
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qoSagh qlIStIy
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« Reply #3 on: 10 06, 2005, 05:28: PM »

I Have Seen the "Butter Cookie" Refered to as the M.O.H. in Several Venues, (Though not in anything Canon), When I First Asked about that Particular (And Very Common) "Medal" I Was Told that it was Chang's Family, or House Designation... (Now, after Many Years in Klindom, I am Sure that the Person I Asked was Guessing)... Anyway, I Had up to that point been Wearing it because it was a Definate Klingon Symbol, But Once I Realized that it was an Unknown Quantity I removed it From my Uniform... Today I Wear Very Few "Medals" on my Honor Sash, In Fact I Only Wear My Club Emblem, My First "Ships" Emblem, My Current Chapter Emblem and My House Colors... (Occasionally I Wear a Tre-foil, Always Placed at the Top of My Sash)... I Wear None of My Old "Awards" Since I Have Started a New Persona, and Have Not Been Awarded anything to date.

As to the Translation of Canon Awards to Role-play, I am In Agreement Overall With the meycha, In that I see What happens on the Shows and Films as Being Very Far away from My Clubs little Corner of the Universe... Thus Haveing Such Lofty "Honors" does not Make a lot of Sense, Where as Those "Honors" awarded by the Club are Much more Valuable because they are Recognition from the Group...
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Archbishop Nej vIt SutaI-H'Nter,
Spiritual Advisor to K.L.A.W. 4th Fleet,
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http://www.klingonlegion.com/summergames2006/
qoSagh
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« Reply #4 on: 10 07, 2005, 07:46: AM »

On my old cloak there are many medals, some bought and some made, most of which were there for show. I was at the time playing a very old Klingon (117 years old) so I designed a cloak that would fit with the role play. After a few years that character was killed. qoSagh is not that old and as such would not be decorated nearly as well. I am working on a new cloak now, which will probably not have any medals. I have been collecting Klingon patches for a few years to used instead.

I have found the same problem with patches that I see with medals. I bought one off of eBay, which I stillthink is one of the cooler looking ones. The seller gave it a name but not much other information. I have since found out it is the logo of a fan created house, so I am in no way entitled to wear it.

On a side note, the transition from pins to patches is also functional. After years of transportation issues, the resin pins have taken quite a lot of abuse and now have chips and such, which get caught on the cloak fabric and pull threads. I can only hide so much under the heading of battle damage.
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qoSagh qlIStIy
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« Reply #5 on: 10 07, 2005, 08:38: AM »

I have 2 kill stripes that my ship has earned, I wear them on my sleeve.  I also wear my house symbol on my upper left sleeve. I have one really neat looking pin that was given to me for xmas many moons ago that I wear.  I also wear any badges from events I have participated in.  I don't have a sash or cloak so I'm limited on what I wear.  However, those I wear I have earned.

One of the bat'letH tourneys I've been to uses the D'Har title for the winner of the event, like bat'letH D'Har, d'k'Tagh D'Har, etc...  To me that would be a legitimate use of the "D'Har" title. BTW...Koloth and Kang were D'Har Masters as well, don't want to forget them.

Now the're countless sites that have several really really cool looking medals. I've even tried to make a few, but time usually keeps me from it. Like said earlier, if you want to wear them, do so. If your org. allows it. 
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Lt.Col. K'Allen sutai-bortaS
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Krag
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« Reply #6 on: 10 07, 2005, 12:34: PM »

Thank you for your welcome, Nej vIt. The question is academic and does not pertain to any club or organization. I was speculating how a real Klingon in the Star Trek universe would wear their medals, and in what order.

I agree there are probably too many "D'har Masters" and "Order of Kahless" recipients running around in the world of fandom who are unworthy of their titles, but the #1 goal of most fan clubs is to have fun, so I take these individuals and their awards with a grain of salt.
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« Reply #7 on: 10 07, 2005, 01:17: PM »

qoSagh,

Such matters have Come up in Discussions of our Club at times, Namely, Do the Honors of a Member Playing a "Given" Persona transfer to other Personas? (i.e.) Can an Award Won by KORDAK be Worn by Nej vIt? And I Think it would be Circumstantial, I am a little more Conservative with the Rules that I apply to myself then those that I would Hold Others to. So For Me I would Not Wear them, (Particularly Role-play Based Commendations), But I Do understand that for Some the feelings of "Achievement" are Associated with the Efforts that the member may have Contributed to the Club, and thus I would not Hold it Against someone to Wear such an Award...

But this has also been Tricky, in Two Situations in Particular, where Titles I Bore as KORDAK were Significant to Me Personally, but Were Direct Role-play Associations... In that I was a Little "Sad" to Have to Relinquish, the "Line Protector to the H'Nter" And "Protector of the House of HoH"... Both were Based on my own Participation as a Member, but were Deffinately Awarded to the Persona... It Just was Not Logical to Transfer them... (Especially Since KORDAK is still "Technically" Around somewhere as an "NPC")...

I Too Used to Wear Many "Decorative" Pins, to Support the Role-play of My Previous Persona... (Mainly Because there are some really Kewl looking Pieces of Klingon Art out there...<Chuckle>...), But I was Careful to Avoid wearing someone elses Club Pin, House Pin or Club Award if I "Knew" that-that is what it was... But I Certainly Never Claimed "Lofty" Titles or Awards that were not Directly related to my own Merrits...

KAllen,

I Would Enjoy Hearing the "Tales" Of the Kill Stripes Earned by Your Ship, and Also what sorts of Event Pins you are Refering to?

Krag,

Firstly, Thank You for Starting this Interesting Thread... It Looks like some Good Discussion is Coming of it... Secondly, I Agree that the 1st Priority of any Club "Ought to be" Having Fun... All too Often Ego gets in to the Mix though, and The One-ups-menship of Those Many Admirals, Generals and And Ambassadors Whose Long list of Self Appointed Achievements Range from the Kirk Like Saving of the Univesrse, to Piloting the "Most Advanced" Klingon Vessel in the Empire, To Being the Direct Decendant of Kahless or Being the Brother of Martok or Whatever... Though this may Just be for Fun, it is Dissappointing that Such Unlikely Self Indulgence is What Makes these folks "Happy", rather than Actual Interaction with other Fans...<Sigh>...

However, You are Likely Wise to Take the Overachieved With a Grain of Salt... Putting Over Much "Energy" Into being Frustrated by the Sillyness of Others is a Fruitless Prospect...

And You are Welcome for the...er...Welcome...<Grin>...
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« Reply #8 on: 10 07, 2005, 10:58: PM »

I think there would be likely two kinds of awards, one that would carry over to new persona's and the other that would not. Battle honors from a specific RPG session would stay with the character, while say most pints of blood donated would travel with the person. Basically I think the difference would be things done as a club member vs done as a player character.

I know that my title of meycha has transfered onto a second character, and our Grand meycha has transfered to his second or third. This is because that title is more about a general sense and understanding of the organization and the Empire as a concept. These attributes do not go away when one kills a character. Now beragha was a Thought Admiral, qoSagh is a Lieutenant Commander, so some things do not transfer, as well they should not.

As for knowingly wearing someone else's logo, I am now wondering just what some of the other patches I have bought really mean. Some I will probably never know the true story behind.
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qoSagh qlIStIy
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"I would kill the children of a thousand planets, just to see you smile."
Abbot Nej vIt
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« Reply #9 on: 10 08, 2005, 08:36: AM »

I Have Seen Very Few Klingon Patches out there, (Mostly Made by Individuals)... Though I have Noted (Rather Legitimately or Not), That many of the Pins Floating Around out there are hard to Determine Origin on, as Sometimes More than One Person or Group tends to Claim that they Created them for "X" Perpose... There were a lot more Fan Created Pins Floating around out there when I First Joined then there seem to be Now... (Course There is Less of Everything Klingon These Days)... But If I were to Guess, many of them were reproductions of "Found" Art anyway...

Like I Said, and I agree, that some "Honors" Could Translate from Persona to Persona, And Technically within our Group Even Rank Translates with Permission from the C.O.L. (Though I Chose Not to Do this Prefering to Work my Way Back up the Ranks as I Persued the Clergy Branch within the Club)... I Guess that I am Just Not that Wrapped up in my "Characters" Rank and Status, I Would Much rather Participate with the Group, And Have a Good time then Get Caught in the Status Trap... Course it is Also Fun In Role-play to be The Old Grizzeled Veteran at times...<Grin>...
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Abbot, Dugh toy'wI' Library,
http://www.klingonlegion.com/summergames2006/
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