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Author Topic: Disposal of the Dead  (Read 22036 times)
Kesvirit
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« Reply #25 on: 10 05, 2003, 04:51: PM »

posted on 10-4-2002 at 04:45 AM

Artisans and Merchants and Civvies, Oh My!

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quoth Kratnor The Warriors do get most of the press in the empire, and that is biased. They are, apparently, at the top of the social pyramid, with the rulers, and it's they who write the history. They would not exist without the support of the rest of the population.
My arguement in a nutshell.

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Great artisan's and merchant's deaths would be just as significant, the dead would be warned when a wise, and cunning merchant was coming too, probubly.
How do you think that their deaths would be mourned? Or their lives celebrated, or whatever? Perhaps the artist's family, students, patrons, etc would throw a combination feast and showing or recital of students' and master's works?

As for merchants, offhand I can't think of a fitting tribute. Aside from fighting over the deceased's assets, which seems to be a universal practice, what would kith and kin and business associates do for a sendoff? I would guess the dead one's property as well as debts would revert to the Head of House.

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My next klingon clothing construct will be a 'civilian' style tunic, since it is obvious that not all the population would be in the armed forces.
From your statement I take it your first costume was a standard-issue military uniform. What will your next career be, and how do you plan to reflect it in your new duds? As occupations go, only soldiers and diplomats seem to be recognizable by what they are wearing.

- Kesvirit
 
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« Reply #26 on: 10 05, 2003, 04:56: PM »

posted on 3-9-2003 at 05:07 AM

Disposal of the Dead

My klingon family is an old line of mine owners of various ores. We had extensive holdings on Praxis but, needless to say those have all gone down the recycling tube. Now hailing mostly from Boreth the dress is still heavy fabrics accented with fur. A long robe is favored over pants, with two lines of designs coming down from the shoulders, crossing in an X at the waist. The contrasting shoulderpad pattern is retained but only subtlely in the cut of the shoulders. The collar is not as tight around the neck but just as high. Of course the arm guards are retained due to our aggressive klingon nature. Unfortunately during my trip to Earth my luggage was misrouted by yIntagh Ferengi baggage handlers and disppeared into a black hole. So I'm looking for a proper tailor to recreate them.

In our family, at death one's most personal items, clothing, tooth sharpeners hair brushes etc. were burned reverently. The most valued half of one's property was first distributed to any surviving mate, then the remainder,by the epitai amongst the members of the family. It was traditional for the family members to then give these things to subordinate employees of the House. The body is then folded up and placed in a cool dry place and allowed to dry. One sidereal year later it is placed in an ossuary intricately engraved with the traditional shovel and digging spike, in the family crypt. An extremely accomplished individual would have a statue or bas relief in the household to commemorate them. Members who entered the Defense Force where most commonly memorialized this way since it is their habit to sumarily dispose of bodies.
kra'tnor Chas'reeD puQloD
 
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« Reply #27 on: 03 10, 2004, 01:47: PM »

Greetings All I have finally stoppedlurking and joined.

I was interested in this topic because I am currently putting the finishing touches on a Klingon Funeral/Memorial Service. The fact that there is a word for funeral does not always mean what we think. In the strict sense a funeral does not require a body to be present. In America we tend to think of Funerals as having bodys and Memorials not having them. In doing research into funerals I have discovered that in England there is a growing industry of "civil funerals" which are non-religious services.

The "cannon" (oh how I hate that word in Trek context) sources I have come accross would be the TNG episode where one Klingon said "it is an empty husk, do as you will" and the DS9 Episode where Worf had to sit up with the dead as a sign of honor & respect. I still think that bodies would be disposed of like most garbage, however I do not think that Klingons would ever practice any form of canibalism even via replicator. This is evident in that they have seperate terms for "beings capable of using language" and those who do not use language. That is probably one of the fundemental things that seperates Klingons from animals.

The back story for the funeral I am writing is that a ceremony is held on the fisrt birthday of the deceased after death. The Body is not present. The Ceremony serves the purpiose of memorializing friends and comrades and ending the "official" mourning period. That mourning period would begin right after death when the comrades howl to the naked stars, whcih I have always interpreted as Klingon Last Rites. Since there is little time to mourn in battle I do not think that mourning is the same as it is with humans.

Also as an aside, I have always thought that Klingons were multi religious. Not everyone follows Kahless as a man-god. Although I think that every Klingon reveres Kahless as a great leader and historical figure.

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« Reply #28 on: 04 18, 2005, 07:31: PM »

Greetings,

Being New to These Forums, I am Coming into some of these Conversations a Bit late in the Day as it Were, but there are Several Minor Examples of the Likely Hood that Traditions Could Vary from Time to Time, Family to Family and so on...

When the Klingon Captain Tells Jean-luc That the Bodies of the klingons Killed on the Enterprise were "Empty Husks" and to do with them as you will... The Implication Was that If they Died Well then Sto-vo-kor would Sort out the Details of the Immortal, but that the Mortal Remains were Insignificant.

While in another Episode Apparently Worf Props Up a Dead Warrior to "Honor the Dead"...

And Still a Third Mystery is Presented in ST-4: The Voyage Home, When Spock is Studying to Regain his Vast Vulcan Knowledge, the Training Computer Asks Him To Identify Several Symbols, One of Which is "A Klingon Mumification Glyph"... (At Least that is Spocks Answer)...

So It Seems that Were there any sort of Continuity even Implied (Yeah Right), within the Larger Star Trek Universe Created By Roddenberry, But Maintained by Paramount, That There are In Fact Different Ways of Addressing the Issue of The After Life, as well as the Disposal of a Body...

According to Marc Okrand, the Term tlhIngan maH, Means We are Klingons. So the Implication is that What ever the Political Agendas of the Military might be, the Empire is a Much Larger Construct, and that A Klingon is a Klingon... There may be more Obvious "Glory" in Battle than in Some Other Civil Pursuits, But only A Fool Ignores the Usefulness of the Resources Gathered Around them... So It is My Less Than Humble Opinion, that ALL Klingons Who Die Honorably Would Be Entitled to the Same Recognition...

As Far as the Fan Side of things Go, When we have in the Past "Lost" a Member of the Group, They Recieve a Death Howl when next Everyone is together, and it is Appropriate... (Not Necessarily at the Grave Side or in a Hospital For Instance), Regardless of Rather they were Military or Civilian... (But then we are Actually Humans Playing at being Klingons...<Smirk>...)

 
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« Reply #29 on: 04 08, 2006, 08:29: PM »

Spock reading a mummification glyph does not mean that the Empire currently practices mummification.  Just as we do not now (in most cultures anyway) practice mummification but we still understand the concept.  All it means is that they did so at some point in their past.
I am also not convinced about mourning periods as we are told that the death of a Klingon warrior in battle is something to celebrate.  I know the books aren't canon, but I remember reading somewhere about the death of a Klingon in battle and someone says that his father will be happy to know his son has died in glorious battle.  Certainly, bearing in mind that it seems to be every warriors goal to die in battle, I can't see them getting upset about it - at least, not publically.  They may well mourn a family member or loved one privately.
If you read the history course at the Klingon academy http://www.academy.step-into.de/moodle/ it tells us that in earlier times the Klingons did have different death rituals.
Its interesting to note that both the show and the books have shied away from dealing properly with this subject.
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« Reply #30 on: 09 21, 2007, 09:37: PM »

There is an instance of mourning by a female in one of the "Errand of Fury" books, when Kell's brother tells their mother how the former really died. I love the whole scene, the range of emotions she goes through.
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« Reply #31 on: 09 24, 2007, 12:23: AM »

What did the mourning act consist of? Was there a formal ceremony, or was each person expected to keep their grief a private matter? And most importantly (according to the thread topic, anyway), what happened to the body? Was Kell killed in battle? Were there even enough tangible remains to make disposal of the corpse an issue?

-=- Kesvirit
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« Reply #32 on: 11 04, 2007, 10:36: PM »

posted on 7-2-2002 at 08:39 AM

I do not see any reason why the same individual animal would not serve as both a pet and later as food for the same master. Klingons do not necessarily feel the same 'affections' as tera'ngan do for their pats, and they certainly have a different sort of respect for the dead.

I would do my targh the final honor of giving is empty shell for my strength, once he is finished with this life.

     It's probably in bad taste to quote myself, but it is from the message that started this thread so it ties it together a bit more.

     The reason I am bring this up again is because of a recent National Geographic Channel presentation that investigates the taboo of eating the meat of pets, specifically, Dog Meat.

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« Reply #33 on: 04 04, 2008, 07:05: PM »

Being new to all things Klingon, I haven't researched a whole lot, and if the answer to what Klingons do with their dead existed in print somewhere, I'm pretty sure the illustrious one who've responded on this thread already would likely have found it.

I will mention however that in contemplation of Klingon funerals an element that really stands out in my mind, an element that just "feels right" is that of fire.  Fire is an almost universal symbol of strength, glory, accomplishment, and of being freed from the bonds of physicality.  If I were asked to plan a Klingon funeral it would involve a generous amount of fire even if the disposal of the body itself didn't involve cremation.  However, cremation would solve the problem of animals feasting on the corpses near villages and cities, and would solve the problems of space required for containing the cadavers.

The fact that in ancient times Klingons were mummified, however, seems to make cremation an unlikely turn for the society to take.  Even with a loss of religion itself it would make sense for a society to continue some quasi-religious acts merely out of a sense of tradition, and being used to dealing with problems in a certain way.  Many atheistic humans are buried in a manner very similar (if not duplicating exactly) to the prevailing religious norm on Earth, and in some places the primary manner of disposal is law, even if it's not the most efficient method. 

Perhaps the process of mummification (which really requires a society to be willing to look death straight in the eye) would be used to move through the mourning stages, and then the mummy might be burned in order to affect a properly emphatic and noble farewell as well as saving space and avoiding the need to chase off hungry wildlife.


A lot of Klingon thought seems to match human Norse thought, particularly when it comes to honor, death in battle and whatnot, so I'd generally assume much of the disposal process might also be similar. 

These are just a few thoughts on the subject that have passed through my mind in the last few minutes.
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