Klingons at Charity events

[Klythe]

Klingons clubs are amazingly generous with thier time and money for charities.   Let use this area to hail our fellow warriors (and ourselves when applicable) for the effort they put forward to help charities raise money for important causes.

   
This article contains the quote I temprorarily added to my signature line.  "Klingons are known for wearing their unusual costumes at charity events to attract media attention."  There are several different things I can infer from this one line, and most of them I find very funny.

    But this isn't about the media coverage.  Let's hear it for Be'taj and her fellow warriors who went out of their way for a charitable cause.  Her group, the IKV T'Mar based in Tacoma, Washington is regularly involved in such charity events.  

    Please help us recognise other individuals and groups who are making a difference.
 

[tmk1000]

I saw one such event.The 'Klingons' did not act like such.They spoke with a Cajun overtone,did not act very klingon,and were pretty much goofballs.
They have the costumes but not the spirit...

[KAllen]

where exactly was this ship?  

Louisiana is the only state that has Cajuns (Coonass is what they like to be called as well), and my ship, the IKV Bayou Serpent is the only known ship in LA.  I would hate to think that some Klin are not only disgracing our species but a culture that is the backbone of my state.

[tmk1000]

I can't Rember it was sometime but the thought of a Cajun Klingon stuk with me and how dishonorably they acted...They would say random things in klingon that made no sense or ment nothing.

If your going to do something klingon do it right! :lol:  

[Abbot Nej vIt]

I can't Rember it was sometime but the thought of a Cajun Klingon stuk with me and how dishonorably they acted...They would say random things in klingon that made no sense or ment nothing.

If your going to do something klingon do it right! :lol:

It Occurs to me (After Reading the Above), that it is Important sometimes when in the Company of Mundanes, for Us to NOT act too Klingon... A Little Here and there is Excellent, and Certainly During any Public Ceremony, but Over all People Get A Little Turned off, (At least in my Experience), When They Encounter a Group of Any Thing Trek or Sci-Fi in a Public Space Who Take themselves too seriously... It is usually Easier, (Again at least in my Experience), To Get the Average Terran Bystander to Play Along if it is Not So Serious that they Feel Completely Alienated...(Pun Intended)... Different Story When it is at a Con or Similar... Just My Opinion in General, And Especially When it Comes to Charity Events Where we want to Win Folks Over Enough to Feel Comfortable Giving Up their Cash or Time...

[Abbot Nej vIt]

I have never set out to frighten the kids, but I can not stomach the idea of a sensitive Klingon getting all touchy feely for the sake of being a crowd pleaser. If the parent does not want their children exposed to Klingons, then don't bring him over to the Klingons when you see us across the convention center.

Who Said anything about Touchy Feely? My Point is that When We are In Public (And I Specified Outside of Con Environments), we have a Certain Responsibility to The Fact that Fandom, but More importantly Klindom, is Going to Be Judged by the Uninitiated by their Impressions of How Klingon Fans Behave... a "Real" Klingon Would Likely End Up In a "Real" Conflict Pretty Quickly With The Reactionary and Confusing Human General Public... Does this Mean that When we Go Into Those Situations We Should Be Prepared for "Real" Hostilities with the Ignorant Humans? Destroy Public Property? Go Out of Our Way to Disrupt And Break The Law? I Think any reasonable Person would Agree that-that would be Bad News for Klindom, Would jeopardize Future Opportunities in that Venue etc... So It is Toned Down...

I Have Participated in a lot of Publicity and Charity Appearances as a Klingon, It Can be a lot of Fun to Mess with the Crowd, Do the Unexpected Etc... But I Think that it must remain in the Back of Your Mind that it is Only Fun as long as it is Fun... If it Gets Too Serious (And I am Talking about When it is Out of Context), then People Stop "Getting" it and Start Getting Uncomfortable or Uptight... While this Would Hardly Bother a "Real" Klingon, It's Impact on the Communities Perception of my Club and Perhaps on Myself is Important...

So this Was the Source of My Comment about "Acting Too Klingon"... I am Not Talking about Being a Feddie in Klingon Gear... I am Talking about Being a Responsible Fan... As Far as Children Go, I Agree that They are More Likely to Apprciate a Good Scowl then Perhaps their Parents... I Do Not Go out of my Way to Freighten them However, And Will Go Out of My Way for a Photo Op with a Child Before I will with an Adult...

But I am Digressing... I Suppose I Am Overly Concerned by the Impression that we are Talking about "Klingon Sensitivity Training" or some Such Non-sense... When my Real Point was about being Clear about what it is That we as Fans are Trying to Achieve when in the Public Eye... At a Con, During Ceremonies Being An Aggressive Scary Klingon Is Huge... When Collecting Toys For Tots at the Local Mall, Being a Loud But Jovial and Playfull Klingon is Much more Effective... (Again I am Speaking From my Own Experiences here)...

[Kesvirit]

When We are In Public (And I Specified Outside of Con Environments), we have a Certain Responsibility to The Fact that Fandom, but More importantly Klindom, is Going to Be Judged by the Uninitiated by their Impressions of How Klingon Fans Behave... a "Real" Klingon Would Likely End Up In a "Real" Conflict Pretty Quickly With The Reactionary and Confusing Human General Public... Does this Mean that When we Go Into Those Situations We Should Be Prepared for "Real" Hostilities with the Ignorant Humans? Destroy Public Property? Go Out of Our Way to Disrupt And Break The Law? I Think any reasonable Person would Agree that-that would be Bad News for Klindom, Would jeopardize Future Opportunities in that Venue etc... So It is Toned Down...

Indeed. While I share qoSagh's sentiments and believe that Klingons should not stoop to making themselves into klowns to entertain convention crowds, I also believe that Klingons must make certain concessions to the customs of the aliens amongst whom they find themselves. Those who refuse to do so may find themselves permanent, short-lived guests of the authorities. }}:-\ If nothing else, factors of sheer numbers and weapon power come into play.

There is no "dishonor" in foregoing certain aspects of what some may expect to see from "real" Klingons while pursuing higher goals -- GOOD publicity and being invited back, to name two. Even "real" Klingons understand the concept of delayed gratification and learn to control impulsive behavior in order to see a mission through.

Perhaps the goofy, Cajun-accented Klingons cited by tmk1000 were trying  to act as they expected the locals to act, in order to lull them into a false sense of security. This would better enable them to study the local population with an eye toward infiltration and conquest. Such an approach has precedents with varying degrees of success.

Hmmmm... The timing is certainly right... Perhaps these "Cajun Klingons" were serving as part of the Fusion projects, collecting information on Human populations to add to the Imperial databases.

-=- Kesvirit

[Klythe]

Fortunately this topic appears to have been reined in back on topic.   Klingon behaviour in cons is an interesting topics we should explore in another thread.  It looks like it is too late to split this thread cleanly, so We'll have to do it messily...  

   Now where is my Batletlh!

    Now that that is done...   Let's keep in mind we are talking about Klingons volunteering at charity functions.  Roleplaying is great and fun amongst ourselves, I love getting into character and exploring things from a Klingon outlook.  But even here, in a forum where the only things that is on topic are Klingon related, it is disturbingly easy to take RP far enough to cause serious trouble for other board members and yourself.

    When you are working a charity event, duty comes first.  Whether your duty is handing out water to the participants  in a run or a walk or cheering/encouraging them, answering phones at a pledge drive, donating blood, collecting food, or even entertaining children and adults with Klingon themed activities, performing your duty is more important than anything else you might be doing.   If honoring your duties first is not considered in-character, then you need to sit down and rethink what the Klingon Empire would be like if that were true.  Nothing is more in character than honor, and what is more dishonorable than failing your duty?

[qoSagh]

Kai the cleaving of the topics, it allows much better replies to be crafted in both arenas.

I will warn anyone reading this that my opinion on Klingons & charity are going to offend some, but then again what of my postings hasn't done that, so here goes.

I agree that if following your duty does not come first you must sit down and rethink somethings, but it is not the nature of the empire one must think about, it is if the duty you are performing is truely Klingon or not. There are a great many organizations out there that perform a great variety of charitable services and functions. While I know that many clubs have a favorite charity, or work at many different charities, these noble human acts are not Klingon by nature.

Charity is a personal issue to me, we each have the issues we hold dear to our hearts, and each have our groups we support. I have never understood why fan clubs (Klingon or otherwise) feel the need to be organized as charitible groups, instead of just concentrating on whatever they are fans of. Each member is free to work with any and all the charities they choose, but why must these be club duties?

There are alot of organizations out there that are very deserving of your labors, be it in make up or out of make up. But for me at least, and in fact my entire club (small as it has become) we do our charity work outside and seperate from being Klingon. We conccentrate our Klinon time on being Klingon, and our human time on being human.

Some of the worthy charities I have seen supported, seem uncharacteristic for Klingons. Yet Klingon clubs mobilize in droves to help out. I suppose helping as a Klingon is better than not helping at all, but I think all this charity work helps reinforce the idea that Klingons are a happy friendly lot, which leads to the confusion in behavior at conventions and other events. As much as it hurts me to quote the un-klingon himself I must:

"Sir, I protest, I am not a merry man"!

[SoplaHtaHwI']

I think this is a view that holds both objectives in high regard:
Klingon spirit and Human charity. When is a Klingon Charitable indeed?

[Kesvirit]

When is a Klingon Charitable indeed?

When it is in that Klingon's express interests to do so.

I have never understood why fan clubs (Klingon or otherwise) feel the need to be organized as charitible groups, instead of just concentrating on whatever they are fans of. Each member is free to work with any and all the charities they choose, but why must these be club duties?

quoth qoSagh in Klingon Behaviour in Conventions:
One of the best Klingon quotes I ever heard was that wearing the headpiece was a license to act like an (insert favorite profane term here).

I believe that the third quote answers, at least in part, the one's question.

Back in the mists of time (circa 1990), rumors reached my ears of Klinfolk using the headpiece/uniform as an excuse to be rude, obnoxious, disruptive, and put others in danger at cons and other events. As a result Klinfolk were being barred from Trek and SciFi events right and left.  Though this is only conjecture, I propose that the practice of Klingons organizing in charitable groups was in an effort to rehabilitate the collective reputation of Klindom and get the bans lifted.

Granted, these rumors had travelled across vast distances to reach my ears, and I repeat that this is conjecture. But it does not sound unlikely. I hope that anyone reading this who was active in the con scene at the time can provide more details.

-=- Kesvirit

[qoSagh]

Although we are risking these two topics mixing again, I will reply.

There is quite a big difference between being rude and being dangerous. I can growl, yell, and otherwise act like a word not permited here, without putting anyone in danger (either myself or others).

I had never heard of Klingons in general being banned from conventions, I have known stories of a couple of clubs that stopped going to specific conventions by mutual agreements with the convention producers. I think however that that does not explain the charity connections.

I have noticed that federation clubs tend to do alot of charity work. While this is slightly more in character for the feds, I still maintain that there are alot of fine charities out there that need your help as an individual. I think that there are a lot fo Klingon clubs out there that are little more than "starfleet with ridges" the entire structure being taken from Federation based clubs, thus also the charitible contributions.

As for reforming our image, I don't see any need for reforming. I want people to think of my Klingon persona as rude, beligerant, obnoxious, arrogant, argumentative, ect. In short, the Sword of Kahless should never be used as a platform to display ones prize winning petunias.

[Abbot Nej vIt]

...<Howls With laughter>... Prize Winning Petunias Indeed... And I Should Say Not, Unless that ba'tlh was being Used to Clear a Path Through the Terran Vegetation For The Warriors Following Behind You...

First Off I Am Likely In Danger at this Point Of Sounding Like I am More Pius than I am... I Do Not Spend Every Waking Moment Planning My Next Charity Event, Nor Do I wish to Imply that I Pressure My Crew into Doing So Either... I Just Don't Want to Falsely Advertise my Charity or Community Involvement... I Have Great Respect For Those Who Regularly Help Others... I Do it Occasionally...

I Think that it is Likely a Legit Argument to Make that Klingons Might Not Support Charities as Humans Would... (After All Klingons are The Ultimate Example Of Darwins Principles in Action)... And Charities Are all about Assigning Valuable Community Resources towards the Supporting of The Weak, Old and Infirm...

For Myself, However, I Think that this Discussion is A Clear Example of Why There are So Many Different Groups out there... Different People Need and Want Different things From their Time Spent on Hobbies... I Have Many Hobbies which do not Translate so Well as Fandom Does to Supporting Charity Work... That Having Been Said, For Some Folks Perhaps Doing Charity Work IS a Hobby, For Me it is Not, I Have Neither the Time, Resources Nor Inclination to Make Charities a Priority all of the Time, and I Do not Find Asking People For their Hard Earned Money to be Particularly Enjoyable... But By Combining it Occasionally With Something I Do Enjoy (Like Playing at Being a Klingon), it makes it More Fun for me...

For Those who Feel That it is not Appropriate For them to Participate In Community Oriented Public Events While Dressed as A Klingon... Well, That is Exactly Correct For You... Anyone Who Does Something out Of Compulsion rather than Because They Want to, or Who Does Not Get Something Useful out of the Act, Definately Should Not Do it...

As To Klingons Participating in Fund Raising, Charity Work, Adopt a Highway, Etc... And Where it's Origins Come From... I Have to Agree with qoSagh, in that These are probably Carry over Behaviors from Federation Based Groups... I Know that is Likely the Case Down here anyway... Personally though Since I Do not Have the Same Issues with Charity Work Tainting My Klingon Rep, I'm Pretty Kewl with that... The Feddies Do Not Champion Floridas Endangered Birds of Prey For Instance, We Do, So We Have Made it our Own in Some Ways...

To Speak Briefly to the Rude Vs. Dangerous Discussion, I Have Always Thought of Humans as Being Generally Rude... While I See Klingons as Being Direct... Perhaps to a Fault... (In Human Terms)... I Have all too Often Seen Zealous Fans Being Rude because they Think they have "Permission"... This is Different than being Direct, One Need not be a Jerk in Order to be Direct and Honest, I Think Of Rude as Being So Self Centered that One Either Does not Notice (or Care about) the Effect of Ones Actions on Others, or One Is Deliberately Trying to Make Someone else Uncomfortable... As Opposed to Directness which is Just a Matter of Putting things on the Line, Sometimes Directness is Interpreted as Rude, But Intentional or Oblivious Rudeness is Never An Honest Form of Communication... Dangerous on the other hand is Just Dangerous... And Real Klingons Would Be Dangerous, To Others at least...

As To Klingons Being Banned From Cons, I Had Not Heard of Such myself, Though it Reminds me (Off Topic Alert), Of How one of the Ren Faires Down Here (Alledgedly), Started Cracking Down on their Weapons Policies Because Being Florida, And Being that Faire Season and The Various Bike Week Festivities are More or Less the Same time of Year, There were Problems with People Wanting to Carry Non-costume Steele into the Faires, And Citeing That If Someone Could Bring a Sword in, then They Should Be Able to Bring in What Ever Weaponry they might wish... After having a Couple of Years of Problems With Drunk Faire Goers Brandishing Weapons, it was Finally Decided that a No Weapons Policy Would be Adopted... Now This was Related to Me At the Gates of the Faire in Question in Response to my Question as to Why I was Not Being allowed to Bring a Sheathed Peace-tied Dagger into the Faire While in Costume... Needless to say I Do Not Attend that Particular Faire any more, But the Point is Valid non-the-less, which is that all it takes are a Few People who do not much care what happens to those who follow, to have a permanent affect on the Opinions of others, Potentially Changeing things for everyone...

And No Worries Here qoSagh... I am Not Particularly Offended by your Commentary...<Toothy Grin>...

[Kesvirit]

Though it Reminds me (Off Topic Alert), Of How one of the Ren Faires Down Here (Alledgedly), Started Cracking Down on their Weapons Policies Because Being Florida, And Being that Faire Season and The Various Bike Week Festivities are More or Less the Same time of Year, There were Problems with People Wanting to Carry Non-costume Steele into the Faires, And Citeing That If Someone Could Bring a Sword in, then They Should Be Able to Bring in What Ever Weaponry they might wish... After having a Couple of Years of Problems With Drunk Faire Goers Brandishing Weapons, it was Finally Decided that a No Weapons Policy Would be Adopted... Now This was Related to Me At the Gates of the Faire in Question in Response to my Question as to Why I was Not Being allowed to Bring a Sheathed Peace-tied Dagger into the Faire While in Costume... Needless to say I Do Not Attend that Particular Faire any more, But the Point is Valid non-the-less, which is that all it takes are a Few People who do not much care what happens to those who follow, to have a permanent affect on the Opinions of others, Potentially Changeing things for everyone...

Foolish Faire-goers... Ruining other peoples' RP fun... Where are those g'daya busybody lightbulbs when you need them?

-=- Kesvirit

[qoSagh]

I've seen foolish con goers too, who either carry weapons (largely sttel) when out of costume or who buy a new weapon in the dealers room and brandish it about instead of putting it away in a vehicle or hotel room or where ever else it should be.

I have also seen convention rules that go way to far, in their attempts to be safe. One I go to semi regularly has a rule that states no firearms will be allowed at the convention. This is basically a good sound rule, although I have mixed feelings about it from a constitutional standpoint. My big problem comes with thier definition of firearm, that reads any real or siimulated firearm or any prop or replica that even looks similar to a firearm. My problem is with the extremely subjective "looks similar" which I have been told by convention staff means phasers and disruptors, because they are the same general shape.

I agree that all it takes are a few bad apples to ruin it for everybody, but at least in my experience the few bad applea are rarely if ever the Klingons in the crowd. Our least honorable is still a step ahead of everyone elses most honorable.

[Abbot Nej vIt]

I've seen foolish con goers too, who either carry weapons (largely sttel) when out of costume or who buy a new weapon in the dealers room and brandish it about instead of putting it away in a vehicle or hotel room or where ever else it should be.

I have also seen convention rules that go way to far, in their attempts to be safe. One I go to semi regularly has a rule that states no firearms will be allowed at the convention. This is basically a good sound rule, although I have mixed feelings about it from a constitutional standpoint. My big problem comes with thier definition of firearm, that reads any real or siimulated firearm or any prop or replica that even looks similar to a firearm. My problem is with the extremely subjective "looks similar" which I have been told by convention staff means phasers and disruptors, because they are the same general shape.

I agree that all it takes are a few bad apples to ruin it for everybody, but at least in my experience the few bad applea are rarely if ever the Klingons in the crowd. Our least honorable is still a step ahead of everyone elses most honorable.

Geesh... The Lawyers and the Insurance Companies really do Run the World...

Our Local Faire, and Most of the Local Cons are Fairly Liberal about Weapons Policies... And Over all most Folks seem to be fairly Respectful of the "Rules"... Fact is there are Always Going to be those who Can not or Will not Consider the larger ranging effects of their actions on the rest of the Community... (Or Sub-Community as it were)... And although I Do not "Need" to Carry live Steel in order to have a Good Time, I do like to Carry my taj while in Character... I Would Not However Carry a Bulky Aluminum or Steel (Or Plywood or Plexiglass for that matter), Spear, Ba'tlh or similar around a Con just to have it... Ceremoinies or other Planned Events are a Different Matter of Course...

[qoSagh]

I agree on not bringing out the large weapons unless there is a specific need, and walking around the convention does not in any way create such a need. I only have one ceremony that requires the use of a betleH, so If I don't know in advance that it will be performed I usually leave mine at home.

I did use one for a static display once, which lead to a funny story. I had a semi-circular table set up, and put the betleH in front because the curve matched. Now this betLeh was a poorly made alluminium one which had been polished with a small rotary tool, leaving a series of small circles on the face. A group of younger fans (probably 12 -14 year olds) and asked if it was "the real one" and how it was made. Being in full character, I made up something like it was forged in the fires of battle and quenched in the blood of my enemies. One of the youngsters jabbed his friend and said see I told you I knew all about swords, see these circles, those are hammer marks from the blacksmith. It was very hard not to bust out laughing at this line.

[Abbot Nej vIt]

....<Grin>.... I Can See how a Youngling might Mistake the Circular Pattern for Hammer Marks... Good Come Back BTW...

[qoSagh]

See you attribute it to a youngling making an honest mistake. I have long thought it to be misplaced arrogance. Some of my best Klingon lines have been such adlibs, sadly I don't always remember them. I have a friend who is a dealer at conventions, he periodically has some nice Klingon stuff which he usually saves for me. He once had a nice metal Honor sash at his table and as I was talking to him a youngling walked up and picked up the sash remarking how heavy it was. I adlibbed "that honor is heaviest for those who must purchace it". The youngling dropped the sash and left. It took quite alot to make up for costing my friend that sale.  

[Abbot Nej vIt]

Heh, Heh, Heh... I'll bet... And You are Right, I Do Tend to Give Folks of All Races the Benefit of the Doubt... And Being the Father of a Youngling myself, I Do Know How "Certain" my own Daughter can be of her Assumptions about the World around her... Were I To Assume it was Pure Arrogance I Likely Would Have Long ago Destroyed her Confidance with Sharp Reprimands rather than Encouraging her to Embrace the "Truth" of a Given Situation... That Having Been Said, The Benefit of the Doubt Will Wear thin Quickly with me for those who do not behave with Integrity...