is -moH always a suffix?

[reySIr]

Hi all-

In my intro thread, we got into a discussion about how to say "I am honored to be here", which in turn led to the verb quv and quvmoH.  I have some more questions about that.

I would read jIquv'egh as 'I honor myself', but it's not really grammatical (or, at least, I've never seen -'egh used on quality verbs).

The use of -moH is a pretty advanced topic, but to be brief, quvmoH means to honor someone else (technically, it turns the subject of a quality verb into the object of an action done by someone else: 'I cause you to be honored' =  'I honor you.')

yIquv'eghmoH just means 'Be honored!'  It's actually kind of a weird thing to say.

I think my confusion here lies in the nature of quality vs action verbs.

quv means either "honor" as a noun, or "be honored" as a verb.  So anytime i see a verb prefix on it, i want to add "are" or "am" to my translation.  "I am honored".  And so if i see the 'egh, i want to further add the word "self" or "me".  Hence i get "I am honored me."

quvmoH seems to be the action verb.  Here's what i need to know about it (and other verbs).  From TKD, it appears that quvmoH is it's own word, an action verb.  It has the clear roots of quv and -moH, but has become it's own word.  It could be treated just like legh "see".  

So, for example:

choquvmoH: "you honor me"
cholegh: "you see me"

maquvmoHchuq: "we honor each other"
maleghchuq: "we see each other"

Normally, the suffix -chuq would occur before the suffix -moH.  But in this case, there actually isn't a -moH suffix.  quvmoH is a complete verb word, just like legh.

At least, this is how i read it from TKD, since quvmoH is listed as it's very own word.  I mean, it doesn't list every combination of verb and suffix as their own words, so it made sense to me that those listed are complete verbs, even if they have part of their root from other suffixes.

So i guess my question is... are verbs like this treated as their own words or not?  How does one know?


-reySIr

[ter'eS]

I should probably let someone else chime in, so this isn't just you and me in these threads, but, what the hey...

I'd forget about trying to use -'egh with quality verbs. Quality verbs don't take objects (in English, either: you can't say *'I'm happy food'), -'egh doesn't imply an object anyway, and I don't think it makes any sense to use it on a quality verb.

BTW, the terms 'quality verb' or 'action verb' aren't found anywhere in TKD, they're just terms the KLI mailing list came up with to describe different types of verbs.

As for verbs with -moH on them, Marc Okrand has stated that they are in the dictionary separately mainly to help people find words, but that they aren't separate verbs from the verb without -moH. The best example of this is ghoj/ghojmoH: 'learn/teach'; possibly someone would think there was no Klingon word for 'teach' if it didn't have it's own entry. The upshot is that you still have to honor the suffix ordering even with verbs with -moH: maquvchuqmoH. As best as I can recall, you always honor the verb suffix order with every suffix except the rovers.

[reySIr]

As for verbs with -moH on them, Marc Okrand has stated that they are in the dictionary separately mainly to help people find words, but that they aren't separate verbs from the verb without -moH. The best example of this is ghoj/ghojmoH: 'learn/teach'; possibly someone would think there was no Klingon word for 'teach' if it didn't have it's own entry. The upshot is that you still have to honor the suffix ordering even with verbs with -moH: maquvchuqmoH. As best as I can recall, you always honor the verb suffix order with every suffix except the rovers.

Ah perfect.  In my own learnings, i've been treating them as their own words.  But now i know better.

Does this concept also apply to other suffixes?  For example, lo'laH means "be valuable", literally "it can be used".  So to say "we are valuable to each other", would you say malo''eghlaH?  (Because lo'laH is in the TKD for clarification, not because it is its own unique word?)

-reySIr

[ter'eS]

I think you need to join the Klingon Language Institute mailing list. You will find many like-minded people there, and will get many answers to your questions.

Edited to add: I'm not implying you shouldn't be posting here! But the KLi is full of folks who will love to give you their opinions about any aspect of the language you desire.

[tesseraktik]

In this article, Marc Okrand discusses glosses, -moH and lo'laH.

[reySIr]

In this article, Marc Okrand discusses glosses, -moH and lo'laH.

qatlho'.  Dajqu'.

Which, if i've translated properly,  means "thank you.  very interesting."


-reySIr

[tesseraktik]

qatlho'.  Dajqu'.

Which, if i've translated properly,  means "thank you.  very interesting."


-reySIr

qar mu'meylIj {Your words are accurate}